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It was definitely Tuesday 29th June, I remember the day well, having just read that you and I will shortly no longer be able to buy a box of dozen eggs or anything else for that matter which comes in dozens, our friends in Brussels have decided it will be only legal to sell 10’s. There is a theory circulating, which of course I could not possibly subscribe to, which is as our continental friends have only ten finger’s, after which they get confused, do we need them?
Well it was on this momentous day that I happened to be standing in our yard waiting for our son-in-law to arrive to pick up the grandson who had of course been the usual confusion, when I heard the roar of Noel’s Caddy van, on my way to the gate I stopped a superb looking black P4 Rover purred past, it might have been a 105, it was gone so fast I couldn’t get to the gate to see. It was heading in the direction of Ballykeefe, I have made a few subtle enquiries and a name has been put forward but we do not have sufficient evidence, however a few months ago a red Jensen interceptor passed heading in the same direction. Can you add to this story?
As a result I decided why not write about the P4, in fact there was at least 8 different P4’s, however my search started looking for the designer, no doubt you have put two and two together by now, yes Gordon Bashford, in fact he designed the model before, the P3 he also had a hand in developing the Range Rover, but there the research came to a stop, nothing about his early years and after the Range Rover nothing.
The Rover Company was one of the most successful of British Automobile manufacturers, the Wilkes Brothers took over the running of the company round about 1932 when it was in dire straights and they stopped at the helm until the early 1960’s when Rover was almost awash with money, so much so they invested in Gas Turbine power, it has been muted that had Rover not become part of the Leyland’s crumbling empire they might well have taken over BMW rather than the other way round
The P3 burst on to the scene in 1948, it looked like the pre-war 12 and 16, however it had many new panels though retaining the wings and bonnet from the older models, it did sport the new Rover engine which now had overhead inlet and side exhaust valves. Two versions were available a 4 cylinder 60, bored out to 1595cc and a 6 of 2103cc for the 75.
This first post-war model was only intended as a stop gap until the p4
Came on the scene, but nevertheless car starved Britain took 9111 of these models.
The independent front suspension was new for Rover though they still had the hydraulic come mechanical brakes. The chassis was also new.
The engine and gearbox were used in the new Land Rover first series.
One might wonder why Rover’s did not suffer the indignity of tin rot, well not to the degree of some of the other marques, it’s a good story, apparently steel being in short supply old and damaged ships were being recycled, fantastic idea except that they were often very rusty through being at sea etc, the wise board at Rover said no, we prefer to make fewer cars, so that is an interesting fact.
The P4 – 60 made between 1954-1959
75 1950-1959
90 1954-1959
80 1960-1962
95 1962-1964
100 1960-1962
105 1957-1959
110 1962-1964
Going backwards the 110 had a Westlake Head, which ensured the car developed 123BHP with a 100mph top speed, petrol consumption peaked around 18-23mpg, the 110 had a 60/40 front to rear weight distribution which gave excellent road holding for such a large and heavy car.
There were two 105’s the S and the R, the S indicating syndromes and the R overdrive, in truth it was in reality a twin canb version of the 90, and subsequently it almost reached 100 mph, the R was dropped in 1959 and the S continued for another year as the 105, 3500 models made as auto’s and 7170 manuals.
100, was well sold 16621 came out of the factory, it had a 7 bearing crankshaft and the engine was bored out to 2625cc giving 104 bhp, you also got servo assisted disc brakes and a rear axle widened to maintain the track.
The 95 produced in 1963 alongside the 110, but due to delays of the 2000P6 the same power unit as the 100, though BHP quoted as 102 and top speed in the region of 93mph, to a degree such data is not important for a series of cars known as the most british of british cars, in 1964 the doors, boot lid and bonnet changed to steel, only 3680 95’s made, the last P4 to come out of the factory is reputed to be a 95, however there is a certain amount of contention as to the truth of this statement.
Like all things there are dirty deeds, when Leyland took over Rover they added another luxury car to their range having already got Jaguar, Rover had been eating away at the Jaguar traditional market, this apparently did not suit Wm Lyons former Jag boss and now on the board of Leyland, tactfully he made sure Rover was not going to be the prestige car of the group, and another thing we got Lord Nuffield of Morris fame, the Lord Rootes of Hillman etc, Sir Donald Stokes Triumph, Sir Wm Lyon’s Jaguar so on and so, but notice but no one from Rover got a title for their efforts and this is despite the so called upper echelons of society in Britain using Rover cars, in fact one Prime minister actually purchased 100 P5’s and had them stored.
To end this story from what I have learnt the Rover name together with Daimler and Lanchester, good old solid cars, are now the property of the Chinese, anyone for a Rover and Chips?
Ted Lay tedlay@gmail.com
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Just to let you know it is back on Sunday night at 8.00 on tv3
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By the time the various magazines reach us the chances are that the classic we must have has gone, of course there are cars that seem to appear week after week, one wonders why. One car I kept track of was advertised for almost a year.
We then come to the price, it is difficult to give an accurate value on a car there are so many factors to take into account, despite the listings some magazines print.
The truth is that most of the classic cars come in from the UK, however the seller is not going to lose out, how much is added to the actual original purchase price, no way of telling.
The one, well one of many bugbears is how cars are described, immaculate, hmm, lady owner, does this mean greater care has been taken or it is driven delicately, if my daughter is anything to go by not a chance.
One can go chasing all over this island looking for the perfect specimen, costly and time consuming also frustrating to say the least.
I must put this in, that one of the safe places to buy a classic is through the club, if you are no mechanic there are enough members who would no doubt be delighted to give an opinion.
Car auctions, are big business across the water, a great choice of vehicles and you can get guide prices, though as it says a guide.
One point you must remember is whether you go privately or to a dealer or an auction it is going to cost to get the car home.
Just to run through a few points, ferry crossing, accommodation, and food fuel depending how far you are traveling, insurance on the car and most of all paying for it, bearing in mind the rate of exchange at that time.
Just to give you an idea when I purchased the Volvo, it was a private deal, it was a stupid chance to take but I was lucky, the insurance was arranged before I went, the money was electronically sent to the vendors account, we estimated the time for the journey from Holyhead to Harrogate would allow us to come back on the first ferry Sunday morning, we didn’t have to pay for the trailer or the car coming back, but I am told we were lucky, fuel then cost about E100, the accommodation was with the ferry company and we got a good deal but not a lot of change out of E500, we gave a great sigh of relief when we saw the Volvo, so if you need to think about it, perhaps that will do as a start.
I was looking up forthcoming auctions and here are some of the prices being quoted:- These are Sterling
1935 Austin Ruby Opel 7500 – 9000
1983 Merc 280SL 5500 – 6500
1979 Merc 350SL 4250 – 5250
1971 MG “B” 2500 – 4000
1967 Sunbeam Alpine 4750 – 5750
1964 Austin 1100 1500 – 2500
1969 Austin 1300 2000 – 3000
1960 Singer Gazelle Convertible 4000 – 5000
1961 Zephyr Farnham Estate 2250 – 3250
1954 Rover P4 90 1000 – 1500
1967 Triumph 2000 1500 – 2000
1966 Morris Mini Cooper s 16000 – 20000
This is the actual Earls Court Motor Show Model
1970 Lotus Cortina 11000 – 13000
1968 MG “C” GT 10000 – 12000
The listing comes only from the top auction houses where one expects quality cars.
Ted Lay tedlay@gmail.com
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We have spent some time creating a new online web presence for our members and for the general enthusiast. This site will provide you with all the latest information about the events we organise. Our club meetings are normally held the first Monday night of the month at 9pm. Keep an eye on the site for the venue for these meetings. We hope you enjoy the site.
Rallying
We organise two main rallies in the calender year, namely the Stonethrowers Rally based around Clonmel and usually held in the month of August. The club also organises the Sean Conlon Memorial Forestry Rally in Mitchelstown. >>
Hill Climb
We run the famous Dungarvan Hill Climb around the June or July part of the year. The Dungarvan hill climb is based on a piece of road called “The Sweep”. This is normally a two day event and there is some very exoctic cars down for the event.
Vintage
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Trim Vintage and Veteran Rally has been running since 1985. It started in a small yard in Loman Street Trim with just 23 cars. The founder Norman Pratt determined to expand the show, approached the Roundtree family who very kindly gave us Porch fields to use on the day.
| It has grown each year since then and now we have in excess of 450 cars and motor cycles on show. It has become a renowned family day out with a lot of different side shows to keep everyone happy from the young to the old.
It has become such a great day that the only thing that could spoil it would be the weather. We have had everything from The Slieve le Mon Armoured Car from the Civil War to the Presidential Rolls Royce. We have had great support from Northern Ireland and the northern visitors enlighten a lot of us greatly with their range of cars. We have also had the Morgan Club of Great Britain over to visit. We receive numerous entries but never know until the day what is going to turn up. |
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One of the reasons for this rally is to raise funds for local Charities.
Attractions at this years event include the following: Vintage, Veteran & Classic Cars, Vintage Tractors & Motor Cycles, Classic American Cars, Aer Corp Flyover and their latest Helicopter the C135, Garda Helicopter, Fun Fair, Hot Air Balloon – World Record Balloonist Pauline Baker will attend, Car Boot Sale, Auto Jumble, Dog Show, TMC Cars (Skoda Dealer), Blanchardstown 4×4, River Rescue, Line Dancing, Junior Football Blitz and Food stalls.
MORE INFO www.trimcarrally.ie
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THE “IRISH MORRIS MINOR OWNERS CLUB ” and the “MUNSTER MORRIS MINOR CLUB” ARE HOLDING THEIR ANNUAL KNEES UP IN BANDON THIS YEAR ON THE AUGUST BANK HOILIDAY WEEKEND..
THEY ALSO HAVE A NEWLY FOUND web site at www.immoc.net Which in now on the “Links list”
This year’s event is being held over two days only.Previous visitors to this event,which was then called the “Bandon Experience”,have enjoyed a whole week of “Craic agus Ceol”. Nonethless,the Bandon Crew put on great show for all.
We have received this latest update from the “Munster Morris Minor Club”…
Friday 30th July.
Rally opening reception in Kilmichael bar at 21:00.
Saturday 31st July.
Mystery Morris Minor Run.
Time:14:00-14:30.(from GAA car park).
Sunday 1st Aug.
GAA Pavillion,Bandon,featuring very rare 1934 Morris Minor.
Car Boot/Auto Jumble Sale and family Fun Day.
Car Booters welcome.(For further details on this;086-8103931)
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ARTICLE FROM www.ford.ie website
The oldest car to qualify under scrappage scheme?
30 year old Fiesta exchanged for 2010 model
Cork, 15 June 2010 – Mary Cummins from Kilmessan in Co. Meath, this week, entered the record books when she “scrapped” her 30 year old Fiesta in favour of a new model at Navan Ford Centre, Navan, Co. Meath.
Speaking at the handover of a new 2010 Ford Fiesta to Mary, John Robinson of Navan Ford Centre said: “As far as we know, this is the oldest car that has been traded in as part of the Government scrappage scheme. The car was first registered in May 1980 and is still going strong – it is a testament to the build quality of the original Fiesta and underlines why the car has continued to be a favourite with Irish motorists right up to today”.
Mary and her husband Pat’s family have owned the car since it was registered in 1980. Originally, Pat’s uncle and aunt, William and Elizabeth Cummins of Dunsany, bought the car new and then when they passed on, Mary and Pat took over the car.
Mary says they have had the car so long that it has become like an extra member of their family. They affectionately called it the “Red Ferrari” and the car achieved something approaching celebrity status on the roads around Kilmessan in the last few years, as Mary explains: “Everywhere we went in it, people would always comment about it. I suppose it is such a rarity to see such an old car on the roads of Ireland these days. I will really miss it but I have to admit I am looking forward to driving our new Fiesta which I think is just a little bit more stylish than our “Red Ferrari”.
Like thousands of other Irish motorists who learned to drive in a Fiesta, both Mary’s son and daughter took their first driving lessons in the car.
The standard equipment on Mary and Pat’s new Fiesta (1.25 litre petrol) such as ABS, electric mirrors and windows, air bags, remote locking etc. – are items that could very well have featured on the 1980s hit TV show, “Tomorrow’s World”, when their original Fiesta first hit the road. In addition, Mary and Pat will have to get used to using such “mod cons” as headrests, 5-gears, power steering and even a radio (there was no radio in the “Red Ferrari”)…
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So it is that night follows day, it is inevitable that Japanese cars are destined to become classic’s joining the illustrious names of Riley, Lanchester, Morris and Sunbeam, one could go on naming the marques that have disappeared over time, like the Japanese all had very humble beginnings.
In the 1960’s no one would have said the Japanese would become a force in the automotive industry, Toyota, Honda Nissan and Mitsubishi are now household names, like the Romans they came they saw and they conquered, unfortunately British car makers failed to take notice, as we know no it was to their cost and the thousands of workers who were thrown on to the scrap heap.
One day I knew the day would come that one would and should write about Japanese cars, despite my love for Volvo and the desperate affair with the Montego, I actually had two cars from the land of the rising sun, the first a Carina ii from Toyota, to say it was a breath of fresh air compared to the Montego, we did 40,000 miles on motorways during that time nothing fell off, it never missed a beat, the day it was collected by the lease company was a sad one, but YTC looked the same as it had arrived, strange as it may seem I saw my old Carina heading for Rosslare one morning, unfortunately I was heading home after dropping friends at the port, it looked like it had found a good home.
Have you been to Rosslare lately, the bar upstairs in the terminal building has gone as has the restaurant/café, the little newsagent in the corner no longer there,if you are thinking about going by train they have even moved the station as far away from the boat as they can, it is not even welcoming,sorry about that.
After the Carina came the Honda civic, again we did our stint on the motorways, another 40,000 trouble free miles, neither car could be faulted.
So where do we start, well the first cars were built for the home market, not for Europeans or American’s, apparently there is a substantial difference between the build of the Japanese to us Europeans, words like obesity and well built come to mind, it seems the marketing people didn’t get it quite right, it has been said in some quarter’s that the American’s had an even worse problem fitting into the early Japanese cars, of course I wouldn’t associate myself with such comments.
We will start with Datsun though we might get in some of the Nissan’s but as it is only a name change it is not a problem. The late 60’s motor magazines tended not to mention any car manufactured in Japan, and some of the classic encyclopaedia manage to mention only the sports cars, the bread and butter cars that ordinary folk buy are largely ignored.
I discovered that the Datsun Bluebird was so well made it was almost indestructible, which ended up being the cars downfall, you might like I ask why so, Hot Rod Racing, apparently so many ended their day’s being smashed to bits in the name of sport, so much so there is a shortage of Bluebirds, if you are one of the lucky ones who owns a Bluebird look after it, during the course of my wanderings there is an abandoned Bluebird in clonea near Dungarvan, it is sitting in a field at the back of Gordons Shop opposite Clonea Strand Hotel, I asked if the car was for sale, the owner became somewhat agitated at being asked, and despite using all my charm I was told No so there. At least I did try and more to the point why leave a relatively rare car out in the elements, near the sea, strange old world.
I will start with Datsun’s assault on the sports car world, the Datsun Fairlady produced between 1962 and 1969, probably not many sold but, however the Fairlady had an engine of 1499cc which gave only 71bhp, it’s ability to do the 0-60 took more than 15 seconds, 1963 saw an upgrade to 85bhp and the following year we got a 1596cc engine, in 1967 a overhead camshaft engine of 1982cc gave 135bhp and blistering performance, top speed now exceeded 108 mph and the 0-60 time of around 10.3seconds, 40,000 models were produced.
It would be a sin to not mention the iconic 240Z, the car that is reputed to have changed the sportscar landscape for ever, for the money what else did 125mph had 0-60 time of 9 seconds, it sold round about 150,000 units, the engine is a 2392cc 6 cylinder overhead cam producing 151bhp which is fed into a five speed box, at one stage it was the best selling sportscar in the world.
After the 240 came the 260Z built between 1974 and 1979, this topped 120mph and had near enough the same 0-60 time as the 240, the power unit was originally a 2565cc engine which produced 139bhp, Datsun upped the power twice first a 2.8litre and the carbs were dropped in favour of Bosch jetronic fuel injection which boosted the power to 149bho then the next increase was in 1977 when they squeezed 170bhp out of the motor, you can imagine a car with this sort of performance sold well in fact nearly half a million 260z’s were made.
Back to the Bluebird or it’s other title the 180B, this was not actually top of the range but was considered to be an \upmarket saloon which could carry five people in relative comfort, power coming from a 1770cc overhead cam engine pushing out 95 bhp connected to a four speed all syncro box giving the Bluebird a top speed in the region of 103mph, the downside being petrol consumption is around 24-25 mpg.
However for your money you got split circuit servo assisted braking with a disc drum arrangement, at the front end, independent coils with Mcpherson struts and at the back coil springs with trailing arms, tyres 165×13’s, it runs on what was then two star petrol, and like most Japanese cars creature comforts were well taken care of, cloth upholstery, front seats that recline, tinted glass, push button radio, electric clock, heated rear windwo, even hazard flashers and reversing lights, all standard.
Funny things crop up researching these cars, apart from abandoned Bluebirds, apparently Datsuns were assembled in New Zealand, but not the Cherry Coupe, though 120 of them were because someone sent the wrong kits, lets hope they appreciated the rarity of the 120.
We will at a leter stage complete the Datsun line up, the 120 Sunny, the Violet and the Laurel and the 260 Estate and of course the two cherries the saloon and the coupe, of course it depends what part of the world you live in as to the name so we will stick to Ireland and the UK
I was looking up Toyota, who according to to-day’s news have another recall problem with the Lexus, that one particular model is on the 8th generation, is it any wonder they dominated the car industry.
Well thanks again and remember drive carefully we need you.
Regards Ted tedlay@gmail.com
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Hi All,
The end of month Éamon an Chnoic guided walk, will take place on Saturday the 24th of July, in conjunction with Upperchurch Vintage Rally & Family Fun Weekend. The walk will commence at 6.00 p.m.
Music, Food Side Shows, Tractor Drives, Crafts, Country Markets, Tug-of-War, Hay Making, Pipe Bands and competitions, are just some of the entertainment to be enjoyed over this two day family fun weekend. Tell your friends….
Please visit our website at www.upperchurch.ie.
Regards,
Upperchurch Hill Walking Committee
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Dear Vintage enthusiast,
We are the Garden of Ireland Vintage Car Club or goivcc for short. We are based in Co. Wicklow and were set up earlier this year to continue our Garden of Ireland Run.
Now our second annual weekend run, Garden of Ireland Run will take place the last weekend in September. I have attached some information on this weekend event. If you could bring this to the attention of your members we would appreciate it.
We are also holding a static display on Bray seafront in conjunction with Bray Summerfest on August 8th if anyone is interested. This is a free day out and with the carnival on the seafront this should prove to be an enjoyable event.
Garden of Ireland Run
September 2010
SATURDAY 25th & SUNDAY 26th
PLEASE PRE-REGISTER before September 15th
Beginning at the Powerscourt Arms Country House in the picturesque
village of Enniskerry the route will take in county Wicklow’s spectacular scenery to include overnight & dinner dance at Ireland’s oldest hotel, the Woodenbridge Hotel in Avoca. Sunday will see a shorter route finishing at the Glenview Hotel, Glen of the Downs, Delgany.
Special Package
Dinner Dance ………………….…………………€30pp
B&B ………………………………..……………………€45pps
Single supplement € 20 per night.
Book B& B directly with Woodenbridge Hotel quoting Vintage Car Run
Ph. 0402 35146.
As is usual to facilitate those partaking in the run we will only guarantee your hotel
reservation once your paid entry for the run has been received by the club.
We would urge you to book ASAP as places are limited.
Looking forward to the pleasure of your company for the weekend.
All Welcome
Contact Daphne 086 1650353
e-mail: goivcc@gmail.com
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